Comments

I know that the mainstream press is running with this, but it seems to me that little good will come out of it. The public is presented with the notion that the RSPCA will deal with this 'aberration'.

Only recently, also, in WA, a ranger, who had filmed a kangaroo dragged behind his car, was not prosecuted.

This kind of behaviour is not surprising given the cavalier attitude of state governments practically everywhere towards kangaroos' welfare.

Vivienne is right to ask if the kangaroo is stigmatised as a pest and a nuisance like the blowfly, why would not socially immature men hoping to impress their peers take it upon themselves to do a mortein job on a kangaroo?

How can we expect fringe dwelling youth to love and respect their natural surroundings when the media daily lionises a race of highly destructive developers who, together with the corrupt politicians who serve them, trash everything nurturing around us?

Land developers are getting so much support from our governments! With our high population growth rate, they are able to grabble for each square metre that comes available. Of course, more people means more taxes and charges, and coffers get filled up more, and more bureaucrats are paid healthy pay-packets! However, population growth is threatening the livability, and in this case too, the cultural icons of the past. We will have wall-to-wall people! This greed is like adding more passengers to the sinking Titanic! Money is the root of all evil!

Cotton and rice are water-consuming crops, unsuitable for our dry continent. However, the real water guzzlers are actually dairy and beef cattle and their crops. Japan has brought out a majority of our dairy companies, and the majority of it is going overseas for profits. More red meat is exported than consumed. The Murray Darling has been used for providing economic benefits for Australia despite it being one of the driest continents on Earth. We should shift from agricultural exports and focus on climate-change technologies.

This is a brilliant article. I totally agree. I am impressed by this paragraph and very pleased to read a sensible statement about how forests store water. The role of transpiration in water table control and local climate is greatly neglected as well. To say the least. Also the observation that Britain unleashed industrialism is very true. Here is the para that impressed me most: Britain's Prince Charles called yesterday for the world to act with a "sense of wartime urgency" to protect the rainforests, warning they were "umbilically connected" to the phenomenon of climate change. The heir to the British throne says rainforests "are the world's lifebelt", acting as the "world's air conditioning system" and helping store the largest body of flowing water on the planet. Such ambitious, ecologically- based policy is welcome from the nation that unleashed industrialism."" I am also very disappointed in 'mainstream' environmental bodies. The forest policies of Greenpeace et al strike me as very piecemeal and ineffectual, making me wonder if that and other organisations have adopted policies of least resistance and least real conflict in order to maintain financial buoyancy. I also agree that the amount of carbon locked up in trees is obviously huge, and, locked up in the fungal mats and soil underlying forests. One of the faulty approaches to climate change mitigation is wanting to soak up carbon gases very quickly (e.g. with new growth) but we have a problem which requires ongoing and additional storage over centuries. Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page

Of course that is an article on realestate.com.au about its rival. I would like to have an analysis or at least comments on Neilson's stats. I would also like to know how both dot coms differ, and how the differ in their approaches, services in the global, local, regional etc real estate markets, and how this has all varied over the property values dive back towards some form or reality as opposed to realty. Today, on the French news very interesting about Spanish housing market. Dictator Franco, darling of the Pope of the time but generally thought to be a horror, greatly increased housing ownership among the Spanish. Prior to the nutty US & Aust, UK and anglophone-led international property bubble, the Spanish began selling the houses they had bought off the government. Then the bubble took them to delusional heights of expectation. Now, three years after the peak in property prices in Spain, real-estate agents and property speculators are on the dole. So are those who found related work, such as photographers working for realtors. One guy tried to move his 3 bedroom speculative appartment in a lottery but this was short circuited by legality. Once pretenders to continuously increasing 'wealth', such people are now living with their parents and unable to get prices above the cost of their constructions. They are lucky that their parents have homes. Land speculation a stupid evil. Australian and State governments have become completely obsessed by it, and democracy has suffered through this. Many societies do not buy and sell land and are better societies for this. Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page

They own domain.com.au, don't they? Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page Copyright to the author. Please contact sheila [AT] candobetter org or the editor if you wish to make substantial reproduction or republish.

Fairfax has always relied on the acres of classifieds for most of their revenue, for whatever reason their management failed to use this advantage when the internet came along. Their classifieds are still number one but this income stream is being seriously eroded by the 3 dot coms: realestate.com.au, seek.com.au and carsales.com.au Maybe in the future papers such as The Sydney Morning Herald and The Age will be transformed into something much smaller and low circulation that focuses on local news with proper analysis that is not coloured by the requirement to fill pages of classifieds.

Oh, also, it's inspiring that the NSW labor party finally, with a lot of help, we might add, from the Liberal Party and the Greens, stood up on its hind legs and got rid of the terrible people governing in its name - Iemma and Costa. This gives one hope for Victoria and other states. Anonymous observes that the Property Council is applying pressure to the vulnerable Victorian government, but why aren't the members of the Labor Party as well? Is there no-one decent left in the party? I am waiting for an article about this. There is one in the pipeline. I wish James would finish it. Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page

Thanks, Anonymous, for this article. I would like to read more from you. I didn't know that www.domain.com.au wasn't doing as well as realestate.com.au, as you seem to imply here. I cut out the full quote of the article because of copyright. Please keep posting. Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page Copyright to the author. Please contact sheila [AT] candobetter org or the editor if you wish to make substantial reproduction or republish.

To that person who posted the comment "Christ you are an idiot," at 3:08PM (+10:00) on Monday 8 September, I would have published your comment (not necessarily including the abuse), if you had explained why you thought I was an idiot. As it was, you did not, so, I have declined to approve the publishing of your comment. Whilst it is possible to call this censorship, I think most site users will acknowledge from the already published comments which are critical of ourselves and extensive links to web pages which contain views contrary to our own, that we don't fear the exposure of our site visitors to contrary views.

I heard most of the high-quality, glossy fashion magazine paper comes from this kind of forest. I hope you can tell me about this. Many magazines and books in Japan are using recycled paper now. But fashion magazines like Vogue, GQ still use very glossy paper. So, we have to educate people about paper.

Yes, I like to have cooked dinners. I like to have them without seawater up to my knees. I think it's possible... if we try to reduce unnecessarily large carbon dioxide, methane, and other greenhouse gas (GHG) emissions. But business-as-usual won't do this, so people have to protest. I DO agree with you that it begins at home. I try to turn off lights I'm not using, cycle to places whenever possible, use fossil fuelled transport as little as possible (I work at home and so travel very little), grow quite a bit of my own food (saves on petrochemicals and food miles) and so on. The problem is that everyone around me is not doing most of this stuff, so my little bit of foregone emissions does not make a lot of difference. What we really need is for governments to seriously put some effort into reducing GHG emissions, and doing it fairly so that everyone is happy with the system and doesn't feel they are being disadvantaged while others are allowed to cruise around in their gas-guzzling SUVs, and so on. Telling people to make a good example of themselves, and to remember all the benefits we get every day from fossil fuels is a good place to start people thinking about the problem in a personal way, but until the governments really get seriously behind this problem instead of paying it lip-service and then allowing things to go on in a business-as-usual kind of way is going to result in many of us enjoying the equivalent of hot dinners with seawater up to our knees (or necks), don't you think?

Sarah Palin is a shameful example of Christianity! How can she believe in a compassionate God and oppose abortion, yet at the same time endorse gross cruelty to His Creation - animals and environment? She should read Genesis where is states that God made the planet and that we humans are custodians and should not kill! The original humans, Adam and Eve, even if mythical, were vegans and were prohibited from shedding blood. Eating some animals was only a concession to Sin, and limited food sources. There was never a license to plunder and destroy the planet and kill native animals. The days of "go forth and multiply" are well and truly over! Sarah Palin is an anachronism and she should go home and read her Bible, and maybe pray for insight!

This website talks plenty about global warming and the nasty coal miners and governments that support them. But ask yourself this... Did you have a cooked dinner last night? Did you have electric lights to see what you were eating? During the recent winter did you use electric heating, or gas burning heater or wood burning heater? When you drove your car did you fill up with petro-chemicals (Diesel, petrol, LPG)? When you caught public transport did you see them filling up with diesel fuel or if electric then the coal power stations that generate the electricity. For you international warriors, did you catch a plane to the city of your global warming protest? If you want to reduce global warming then make an example yourself.

Wielangta Forest has to be protected, not logged. The idea of turning the trees in the forest into paper is hideous. Tasmania has an unique wildlife, which is characteristic for Tasmania only, and it has to be protected. If this ecosystem is damaged, there will not be any chances healing the injury.

Well, counting the health record of Mr McCain, what if he just popped off sooner rather than later ? The prospect of this deranged woman ascending the most prestigious office of the USA and the leader of the so-called free world- scares me. ALL her records point to ALL what is wrong in morality, not just the turpitude of her behaviour towards wildlife. She brings back civilisation to most primitive era and all our efforts to build a better society will be trampled under her foot. If I say "our" is because Carlo Fuentes, the mexican author, said that the American elections have a significance which goes beyond the interests of the USA, and that everybody should be allowed to vote for the American president. It sounds like a good joke, but I wish we could, because the foreign policy of the USA has a ripercussion on world affairs which could be positive or dangerous. How to oppose the triumph of the GOP should be ... an international duty . I shall, on my part, send the article to my American friends, pity that they wouldn't dream of voting Repubblican! Marisa

I'm really amazed! I thought "lucky, wealthy, democratic countries" had passed the stage of cynical, rip-off capitalism a long time ago. Pass a few laws to keep the "greenies" off balance and then slurp up a windfall profit by clear-cut raping a forest while everyone's looking the wrong way? Are we still stuck in the latter half of the 20th century, or do we think, please, we might just wake up to the fact that the world changed somewhat by the time we all made it into the 21st century? I do NOT like to hear the name of my country being used in a context like this. If this is how you are going to supply us materials for paper, then thanks, but no thanks. If there aren't better ways of doing it, then let's not bother. I think a lot of people here will agree with me. Let's see if some of my friends will join me in adding a little note here for the logging company. It really should be a bit passe these days to say something like, "Don't you know that every time we do something to reduce biodiversity, little by little we undermine our own ability to survive on this planet?" Someone once said it's a bit like hearing the rivets pop out fom the fuselage of the plane you're flying in. It's serious and it's scary. But some people do not yet see it and have not yet made the transition into the 21st century. Call us "treehuggers" if you like, but we do know that everything mankind does for survival comes with an environmental or ecological price, sometimes large, sometimes negligible. But "survival" is not a money value. Those who engage in the destruction of nature for money profits (or their children or their grandchildren) will later come to know that selling off the life opportunities of your descendants and those of other species is a highly immoral and hazardous thing to do. Please rethink and join us in a saner 21st century.

The fact that Opposition Leader Ted Baillieu has declared himself in favour of continued strong population growth in Victoria shows that our leaders need to have a strong scientific and/or environmental background. Neither Labor or Liberal have the leadership to ensure a safe environment for future generations. A strong population growth is, no doubt, good for keeping up the demands of goods and services, but how is it to help climate change? How does rampant population growth make it easier to maintain our rivers, soils and food production? Maybe they are under the illusion that money will be able to buy our way out of climate change? A strong economy does not mean an infallible ecosystem. There has to be a limit to growth and surely the warning signals are already here. With more than 10 years of drought, Victoria is on track for the worst-case climate change scenario. Instead of blaming migrants our leaders should be planning for a stable economy and zero population growth.

"It is all complete fabrication. The government could turn off the population growth now and the corporations would just have to put up with reality." I am also deeply frustrated by the way the media portrays the current immigration-fuelled population explosion as if it were some uncontrollable natural phenomenon rather than being a direct result of Federal Government policy. Duped by the pro-immigration lobby and its media mouthpieces into believing that mass immigration is an inevitable force that cannot be stopped, it seems that many Australians have resigned themselves to accepting ever-increasing levels of immigration, along with the adverse economic, social, and environmental effects that go with it. Of course, ongoing immigration-driven population growth is not inevitable; Australia could reduce immigration to saner levels tomorrow with the stroke of the Immigration Minister's pen. All that is needed is the political pressure.

Re the Age article, "City of 8 million 'unliveable'" by Cameron Houston and Royce Millar on September 5, 2008: Who does this ridiculous, pretentious rag believe it is fooling? Presumably primary school children, if well taught, would recognise the difference between projections based on past trends and predictions. Nowhere is it written (except between the lines by the corporate sponsors of the Age) that we HAVE to have 8 million. We don't even have to have one million more. It is all complete fabrication. The government could turn off the population growth now and the corporations would just have to put up with reality. And the government SHOULD stop the high immigration and the baby bonuses now. Otherwise the overpopulation problem is going to make the 'aging population' so-called problem look like the mere bump in the python it is. We do not need population growth. Moreover, population growth is endangering our most basic securities. Population growth is bad for Australia. Fairfax media's really stupid article here is also dangerous propaganda because it fails to inform the readers that 8 million in no way has to happen and it is dangerous to imply that it will. Shame on the Age. Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page Copyright to the author. Please contact sheila [AT] candobetter org or the editor if you wish to make substantial reproduction or republish.

How hopeless! How disingenuous: "the National Water Commission is responsible for driving progress towards the sustainable management and use of Australia's water resources under our blueprint for water reform - the National Water Initiative" We have known about these problems since the first world war. "Driving progress towards..." is just jargon for stalling. How dare our self-appointed masters cripple the country and needlessly deprive other creatures and trees of water! How dare they allow everything they do to be dictated by the corporate sector. Fair Water Use is quite right; we need a state of emergency and a national enquiry. Unfortunately national enquiries are usually conducted within ridiculously narrow terms. We have to avoid yet another allocation of water towards short-term dollars. Fair Water Use would do well to define the terms and parameters and then hopefully candobetter and others can engage enough real environmentalists and voters to force a relevant enquiry. In the mean time, how does Fair Water Use think that the national emergency should be managed? With the army? With what kinds of processes to ensure transparency? I hope to read more. Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page

Our government seems to think that more people, a rising population, is a way to prosperity. There are many countries where there is a high population but no prosperity. If we overload our ecology it will be a struggle to find the resources for everybody. It creates more friction, wars and lack of equalities.

In the choice of the lesser evil amongst the leading pro-population-growth pro-big-business Democratic Party contenders, I had accepted the judgement that Obama was the right candidate on the grounds that he had, at least, opposed the Iraq war at the outset whilst Hillary Clinton had voted for it. However, Obama since appears to have moved closer to acceptance of the continuation of the U.S.'s involvement in the conflict, so the difference in this regard is no longer as pronounced as it once was.

However, an article by Naomi Klein written shortly after Clinton conceded to Obama, I learnt that Obama had employed Chicago School trained Friedmanite economists and had proclaimed: "Look. I am a pro-growth, free-market guy. I love the market." (See Obama's Chicago Boys of 13 June 2008). That Obama would do this after the catastrophic consequences of the Bush administration's embrace of economic neo-liberalism does not sit well with his claim to represent a decisive break from the past. In contrast Hillary Clinton's article No Crisis Is Immune From Exploitation Under Bush of 6 Aug 08, which I found linked to from Naomi Klein's web site, does demonstrate that Hillary at least still pays lip service to the traditional Keynesian Government interventionist policies that had once been the policies of the Democratic Party.

Just passing on another comment from a reader who doesn't post: "I don't disagree with your assumptions, nowhere is it more apparent than in Victoria at this time [that it's the money that talks] I just thought that you were unfairly singling out Barak Obama. We have had enough of George and the Republicans. Ask any teenager in South America what they think of George and his merry men." Sheila Newman, population sociologist for Frank H.

Capitalism started in Britain from a Confluence of: male primogeniture inheritance (product of Salic then Norman invaders) large landless population (due to inherited dispossession) bullion from South America created unentailed capital dissolution of monasteries creates unentailed land commodification of land and wood over-exploitation of woodlands presence of coal and iron in close proximity create "Capital" Massive changes to land-use and land tenure driven by motive of extreme wealth landless population was forced to work for the landed and for factories as whole cities were subsumed to iron production Population fanned out and took over lands in other places Slavery has existed just about everywhere; Africa was not the only place. Throughout Britain there were slaves, even in the monasteries. Slavery only stopped in the 19th C in Georgia and Russia. Large family sizes are an artefact of disorganisation. First there is a die off, then, if you have intensification of settlement then the invaded peoples lose their lands and are educated to have many children because the economy needs workers and that is how they may survive. All the rest is propaganda, IMHO. Including the black/white stuff. It covers up the land-stealing. Coal and oil have made us unaware of how similar all economies once were. In the 16th Century the character Othello had the same status as any other king. It is easier to steal from a country if you stigmatise its peoples and say that you are developing them or educating them or cultivating them, which presupposes superiority. The British did exactly the same to the Irish as they did to the Africans, Indians and Australians. You didn't have to be black to be stigmatised. The British did it to their own poor. Just because it started in Britain is not to say that it was an intrinsically British attribute, that of exploitation under the pressure cooker of unentailed capital. But the British acquired system of land commodification and of overpopulation made the exploitation and settlement by massive numbers of people in foreign lands possible. Unfortunately for the rest of the world. Unfortunately for everyone but a small minority of people who derive the ultimate profits today. Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page Copyright to the author. Please contact sheila [AT] candobetter org or the editor if you wish to make substantial reproduction or republish.

Does anyone really need proof that rent gouging exists? Well I have two examples...I used to live in Eagleby on Brisbanes southside, the 2 bedroom flat I rented in 2002 was $95 a week, it now rents for $230 a week. I had a friend that lived in units in Eagleby that used to be leased by a church group and rented out to low income earners for $120 a week. In April 2007 the owner put them on the market and the real estate evicted all the tenants. Now they rent for $240 a week.... a $120 increase in 12 months? If thats not gouging I dont know what is.

I cam in agreement with what Tim has written, except that I don't think it acknowledges that we can't forward unless we make choices between what is on offer today, however unpalatable those choices may seem. If U.S. electors don't consciously make a considered choice on the spurious grounds that both sides are seriously flawed, then they are effectively giving away what little choice they have left to the U.S.'s wealthy elites through their corporate newsmedia. It would be far more simple if there were a choice between a candidate that was clearly good on the one hand and another that was bad. Because of the stupid, U.S. first-past-the-post voting system, voters can't even register protest votes, such as, for example, for the far more preferable Ralph Nader in 2000, without risking the catastrophe of the 8 years of Bush which did, in fact, occur as a result of votes that would otherwise have gotten Al Gore over the line, being effectively lost (as well as the outright rort of votes in Miami). The other catastrophe, of course was the election of Nixon in 1968, because many U.S. anti-war activists refused to acknowledge that, for all the serious faults of the Democrats, Nixon posed a far greater threat. Of course, in 2000, Gore would have been a very long way from perfect as Tim has shown elsewhere, but it is inconceivable that he would have mismanaged the economy to the same extent that Bush has or, invaded Iraq. Even if he had, it is inconceivable that he could have mismanaged the invasion as badly as Bush did. Whatever can rightly be critically written of Barack Obama, I think it is essential that U.S. voters at least emphatically repudiate Bush's legacy by electing the only possible alternative to John McCain, Bush's heir that is Barack Obama. Still, there are good reasons to be concerned about Obama. More evidence, on top of what Tim has written, can be found in Naomi Klein's Obama's Chicago Boys (and this doesn't even include his failure to confront the problem of U.S. population growth):
Barack Obama waited just three days after Hillary Clinton pulled out of the race to declare, on CNBC, "Look. I am a pro-growth, free-market guy. I love the market." Demonstrating that this is no mere spring fling, he has appointed 37-year-old Jason Furman to head his economic policy team. Furman is one of Wal-Mart's most prominent defenders, anointing the company a "progressive success story." On the campaign trail, Obama blasted Clinton for sitting on the Wal-Mart board and pledged, "I won't shop there." For Furman, however, it's Wal-Mart's critics who are the real threat: the "efforts to get Wal-Mart to raise its wages and benefits" are creating "collateral damage" that is "way too enormous and damaging to working people and the economy more broadly for me to sit by idly and sing 'Kum-Ba-Ya' in the interests of progressive harmony." Obama's love of markets and his desire for "change" are not inherently incompatible. "The market has gotten out of balance," he says, and it most certainly has. Many trace this profound imbalance back to the ideas of Milton Friedman, who launched a counterrevolution against the New Deal from his perch at the University of Chicago economics department. And here there are more problems, because Obama--who taught law at the University of Chicago for a decade--is thoroughly embedded in the mind-set known as the Chicago School.

Hard to do better than this article on Australia's water problems. This is a beautifully written, short and comprehensive page about what has gone wrong with the management of water in Australia, notably the Murray Darling. It succinctly spots what's wrong with COAG. It is systemically relevant. Absolute breath of fresh air. It is part of the Fair Water Use site. Most impressive site.

Well done! And not a moment too soon. The latest report from Australian Society for Kangaroos contains information gathered from government departments pointing to the quasi-extinct status of over half the hunting states of NSW, Qld and SA. Combined with the fact that the average age of kangaroo killed is only 2 (barely at reproducing age for females and not reproducing age for males) and the fact that over half those killed are females does not bode well for the future of our national icon. And where is the allowance in the quota for crashed numbers due to the drought? Up to 70% populations across the nation have crashed from 2001-2006. See full report at www.stopkangarookilling.org

Iemma's claiming that because the Auditor General didn't slam dunk the whole idea, it's received a 'stunning endorsement'. But as Unions NSW secretary John Robertson has pointed out, the report made no reference as to whether it was "a good or bad thing" for the state's residents. Not quite a stunning endorsement after all, then, I'm hoping that history will repeat and that public opinion will halt the process, as it did with the proposal to privatise Snowy Hydro. Many of the arguments made against that proposal are as relevant with this one. .

You are right, Dave. Tariffs stand out as the only logical way to cope with this problem. So the push by the US to dismantle all our trade barriers and social and enviro protection must be combatted. Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page Copyright to the author. Please contact sheila [AT] candobetter org or the editor if you wish to make substantial reproduction or republish.

So, alternatively, what would the BCA propose doing? Probably nothing. The invisible hand of The Market will fix the problem.. have faith. Yeah, right. The concept expressed here by the BCA is the same as the perennial threat by business to move offshore to low wage countries whenever pay rises are mooted for Australian workers. What they're saying is - in effect - 'We don't want to pay the costs associated with the pollution we generate (or in the case of wages, the social problems associated with poverty). If you try to make us pay, we'll take our bat and ball and go offshore to some place that lets us externalise these costs." Which, to my mind, is fine if you only want to sell your products into those same places. But you can't have your cake and eat it too. If you produce goods cheaply by externalising social and environmental costs in unregulated countries, you can't then expect to be allowed to undercut producers who do all the right things in more developed countries with more lucrative markets. It's fundamentally unfair and makes a mockery of the neo-liberal concept of a 'level playing field'. The social tariff proposed by Doug Cameron (former National Secretary of the AMWU), if implemented, would have gone some way to protecting producers who pay decent wages and adhere to environmental laws. Unfortunately, Mr Cameron's proposal for such a tariff was defeated at the 2000 ALP conference. The Government's Carbon Pollution Reduction Scheme may place Australian producers at a disadvantage compared to countries that allow industry to externalise the cost of pollution. Which is exactly why the Government should now move to protect Australian producers - by way of a tariff - from competitors who are effectively being subsisdised by not being charged for dealing with their wastes. Not doing so will see Australia further de-industrialised and may - as Professor Garnaut suggests - actually result in increased levels of global emissions. It will also worsen Australia's balance of trade, which is already in a parlous state as pointed out by Evan Jones in his submission to the review of strategies to enhance Australia’s trade performance, established by Simon Crean earlier this year. Jones, in his usual direct and prescient fashion says.. "Meanwhile, Australia sits on its fat lazy polluting bum enjoying its comparative advantage in coal, sending its best and brightest solar power experts elsewhere to generate beneficiaries and benefits on the other side of the current account. It is not inconsequential that the much-feted "Australia and the Northeast Asian Ascendancy" of the estimable Professor Garnaut heralded one of Australia’s comparative advantages to be a polluting industry tolerance capacity (with the subsidised electricity-guzzling aluminium industry especially in mind). We are now reaping the wind of that particular comparative advantage." Exactly. .

Thanks, Sir John Lydon. Apologies for my errors. They would have been fixed very soon after you posted.

You raise a good point. See the article in the Sydney Morning Herald of 16 August:

Unions NSW step up electricity campaign

Unions NSW has stepped up its campaign against electricity privatisation.

More than 55 union stalls have been set up at shopping centres and fairs across the state, urging communities to contact local MPs and sign a petition against the proposed sale.

...

Unions NSW spokesman Matt Thistlewaite said on Saturday that electricity privatisation would be the primary consideration when the state parliament resumes.

"We've got six weeks to convince local MPs that this proposal is not in the interests of the people of NSW and remind them of the promise that they gave in the lead up to the last election to maintain public ownership of electricity assets in NSW," Mr Thistlewaite told reporters.
...

If local MP's are not yet "convinced" that privatisation is "not in the interests of the people of NSW", with 79% of the NSW public opposed, then when will they be?

The Unions need to decide whether or not they are serious in their stated opposition to privatisation. If they are they should be prepared to do all tath is necessary within their power, up to and including carrying out industrial action in order to change the Government's. If not, then they should stop wasting the time and energy of their membership and supporters in the broader public.

If they had been prepared to act decisively months ago, privatisation have have been buried long ago and those who have been spending their Saturday mornings trying to put their case to the NSW public, who have, in any case, said over and over again that they agree with them, could have got on with their lives.

Tony Boys's picture

Hi vivienne,

Thanks for the comment. People do often wonder why Japan imports so much timber and forest products when forests cover about 66% of the land area. SOME forests are considered sacred (around temples and shrines, for example) and are protected (there are National Parks), but the 'real' reason for the imports is, of course, economics. Imported timber is much cheaper, making it uneconomic for Japan to work the forests. This has upsides and downsides. The upside is, naturally, that they still have their forests, but the downside is that the forests are now not maintained or managed, and so their condition is not good. Fortunately, forest fires are few and localised, due to plentiful rainfall, I suppose. However, large areas of forests are completely unmanaged and therefore overgrown. Storm and typhoon damage make the situation worse.

I do not think it quite true to say that the Japanese do not regard their forests as resources. There have been famous cases in the past, the campaign to prevent logging in the Shirakami Sanchi (northeastern Japan, Akita and Aomori Prefectures) in the 1980s is one of the most famous, of huge public opposition to logging in virgin forests. If it were not for cheap imports, however, Japan's forests might look quite different from what they are today.




[There are lumber merchants in the city who cut Cryptomeria for housing contruction]

The forests mentioned in the article, in the city where I live, are Cryptomeria Japonica. That's not because they naturally grow there, but because they were planted in the 1950s to help sustain the post-war construction boom - they are a great construction tree, but not much else. (I am told that animals will not live in these forests, but only where there are deciduous trees.) In the long-term it would be better for the city if the forests were slowly returned to deciduous trees, which would then provide a better balance for sustainable use after fossil fuels become unavailable.

And that's the bottom line, really - sustainable use and management. Anything else these days is truly asking for trouble. Profits can be made from sustainable use of forests, but probably not on the scale that businesses expect. Unsustainable management of forests, however, will nearly always result in big losses, which the companies try to 'externalize'. It's time they were made to see that these things have a tendency to snap back in your face further down the line.

Which country has the least zoning? the kind that limits housing density and workplaces on land as practiced by western local governments? Because whichever side has the least zoning, that is the side I am on in any conflict since I care about little else including such irrelevent details as who started it. I also care about overpopulation, but from that standpoint Russia and Georgia should be allies since they both have abortion rights and very low fertility rates, so we should be on the side of both, though Russia does edge out Georgia with a lower and thus more environmental fertility rate by a little bit. The Ossetian ethnic patchwork could just swap houses and sort themselves out peacefully too, just like the USian Big Sort.

Very good, article, James, but, as is often the case, there is a bucketload of spelling mistakes and grammatical errors. Hopefully this will be rectified before too much longer. On the Electrical Trades Union, I have to wonder why they won't simply issue the ultimatum as you suggest: either the government agrees to postpone all plans for privatisation until they have been put to and accepted by the NSW public, or the ETU will commence industrial action. With at least 79% opposed to the sale, if they can't win public support for their action now, then when can they ever hope to win it? One can see by looking at how Telstra is attempting to destroy the union, what future lies in store for the ETU should it not act now to prevent privatisation. Furthermore, an awful lot of time and energy has been put by grass roots activists into opposing the sale. The ETU acts as if it takes that activism for granted and behaves as if the activism will always be there. Instead of standing on the sidelines as these activists burn themselves out for what may, in the end, be a waste of effort should the ETU not act, the ETU should now move to the centre stage and take on Iemma, Costa and the thieving investment bankers who stand behind them.

Apparently forests in Japan are protected and are considered sacred. That's why we send woodchips there. We in Australia see native forests as a resource and our leaders allow them to be chopped down for profits. That our Environment minister, Peter Garrett, supports Tasmania's forestry industries is ironic, considering the recent reports of how they are valuable carbon sinks! It is a "sustainable" industry, of course!

The horrific and sadistic crimes against the slow and loveable koalas in Queensland is gut-wrenching and speaks volumes about the moral depths humans can descend to! Feral animals are quite capable of killing for entertainment, but we should be able to assume that as humans we are more intelligent and sensitive to other creatures! About 3.5 million kangaroos are slaughtered each year in a so-called "humane" and "sustainable harvest". Over one million joeys are bashed or left to die. Wildlife are routinely "culled" to please land-owners who claim they are a "pest". With the little status our wildlife are given, it is no wonder we have sick individuals who assume killing for entertainment is acceptable! We already have a global reputation as the greatest wildlife exterminators in the world! Premier Bligh is correct - there needs to be much greater penalties for killing and maiming wildlife, but also our legislators need to give our fauna a much higher status of protection and stop giving permits for massacres too!

What a delightful, interesting and instructive article! Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page Copyright to the author. Please contact sheila [AT] candobetter org or the editor if you wish to make substantial reproduction or republish.

Hi Sheila, There's no denying that solar hydrogen has a way to go before it will even come close to replacing fossil fuels. The point of my article was not so much to suggest that it could - currently- but rather that it was promising technology that warranted greater investment than at present. Having said that, there are concrete, working right-now examples of hydrogen being generated renewably around the world. The Treehugger website reported last year on a solar powered home hydrogen fuelling station that had been developed by CSIRO. Treehugger said.. "We at TreeHugger have never been fond of the hydrogen economy, with its problems of sourcing the hydrogen (really a form of gaseous battery storing energy) and transport. However, this addresses both of these formerly intractable problems." Likewise, the case of Mike Strizki's solar hydrogen powered house in the US demonstrates that renewably generated energy can be stored as hydrogen. In Strizki's case particularly, the system isn't overly elegant. It's big, costly and not particularly efficient. But so were computers in 1978. Problems with storage and transport can't be denied, but without investment into R&D, they won't be solved either. Cheers :)

With all due respect, Dave, this press release sounds like a lot of hyperbole with very few specifics. They talk about 'when the technology matures', but hydrogen storage and transport of the fuel are very problematic. Despite a great deal of money and hype, so far, no-one has come up with any technology that would have hydrogen provide 'limitless amounts of energy'. Maybe you know more about this than I do, in which case, please, details, details, details :-) Sheila N Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page

Some very positive ideas here, Tristan. The concept of shared facilities is one that should be seriously considered as a way of providing a high standard of living to people at lower cost - and with a reduced environmental footprint. Another strategy worth considering is that of decentralisation. Many rural towns have been in decline for years, leaving empty houses that can't be sold. In addition, lots of these towns have vacant blocks that have been cleared and serviced - but never built on. Providing incentives for businesses to move to towns in decline would protect them from becoming ghost towns and take some of the pressure off housing in the metro areas. Moving Public Service Departments to rural centres would have the same effect. The NSW Dept of Agriculture moved from Sydney to Orange in 1991, benefiting Orange and a number of the small villages in the area. Of course, in the long run we can't have affordable housing if demand keeps outstripping supply and we can't sustainably keep building more new housing. There's no substitute for a relatively stable, sustainable population; but until that's achieved the kinds of ideas you propose would help to provide affordable housing in an ecologically sensitive way. .

As I demonstrated in the article Brisbane's housing unaffordability crisis spun by ABC to promote property lobby interests, also linked to above, the ABC has concealed from the Australian public how the property lobby brought about the current housing unaffordabilty crisis in the first place. I agree with the author and with Dave that for them to now turn around and blame one group for this human tragedy is contemptible.

Nevertheless, I think it does need to be acknowledged that some baby boomers have been able to gain massively from housing hyper-inflation at the expense of their fellow Australians, including, it should be also be acknowledged, other baby boomers. As result of economic growth and, more so, population growth, properties brought on the North Coast of NSW for example, for as little as hundreds of dollars back in the 60's and 70's and 80's are now worth millions.

In general, I consider any relationship where someone owns a dwelling that someone else needs to live in to be exploitative. Of course, this is a simplification as I know of landlords, who have worked hard to buy properties that others are able to rent from them comparatively cheaply. Nevertheless, notwithstanding these exceptions and the fact that many elderly people are now dependent upon rental properties for their retirement income, as the author has pointed out, I still think this situation should be actively discouraged, if not altogether outlawed by the Australian government.

A good start to ending this exploitative situation would be to remove the negative gearing concession granted to property investors, or, alternatively, to extend that concession to owner occupiers.

We have to find means other than property investment to provide for elderly people.

A thought provoking article, quark. It's a pity that Australia's national broadcaster has fallen into the mode of superficial analysis that formerly characterised the Murdoch press, in particular. But let's face it, anything divisive is sensational. And journalism just isn't sexy unless it's sensational. That Australia has a housing affordability crisis is beyond doubt. But is it fair to lay the blame on baby boomers? I don't think so. If we're fair dinkum about attributing responsibility for the current situation we could do worse than to examine the activities of the Property Council of Australia, for starters. While on the one hand urging rapid population growth and immigration, the Property Council simultaneously argues for a retention of negative gearing on investment properties. Now I'm not against people investing in property if they want to. But allowing the interest payments on multiple investment properties as a tax deduction, while not giving the same deduction to people buying a single residence to live in, seems unfair to me. A bit like Robin Hood in reverse.. In addition, allowing tax deductions for property diverts investment away from more socially useful investment, in areas such as renewable energy. At the same time, the PCA (consistent with most business lobby groups) sees population growth fuelled by mass immigration as an imperative to address Australia's so-called skills crisis. Coincidentally - no doubt - it's also a wonderful way to push up demand for property. Taken together, what you get is demand outstripping supply and property prices inexorably rising. Over the past 20 years, the Financial Services sector has been all over property investment like a rash. Books with titles like "Own 20 properties within 20 years" have sold like hotcakes and people have flocked to investment seminars run by property gurus. So it's no surprise that people have wanted to secure their financial futures through investing in property. But blaming those same people now for unaffordable housing is unfair and divisive. A responsible approach to the housing affordability situation would be to examine immigration/population, financial incentives like negative gearing and strategies like decentralisation in a coordinated way. But of course that's not nearly as sensational as blaming the boomers. .

Thanks for your comment, Andrew. Back in October 2006, on the occasion of the launch of the 3G network, Sol Trujillo, the imported lavishly-paid Telstra CEO had the effrontery to make the claim that as a result of the 3G wireless network (meaning thanks to him personally) Australia was now a world leader in telecommunications, rather than a 'follower'.

In fact, Australia had been a world leader in telecommunications since at least the 1940's. In the 1970's they had adopted a plan to give every Australian access to fibre optic broadband before the turn of the century. That lead has been largely lost thanks to government imperatives, beginning at least with the Hawke and Keating Labor governments to turn telecommunications into a milk cow for corporations, investment bankers and CEO's such as Trujillo, rather than as a service to the Australian public.

For molr information, see citizensagainstsellingtelstra.com

Australians have not got the expertise to run these vast infrastructure assets, Australians have not got the guts to run them either, just because we designed , built and operated these assets , assets such as Australia's dams, power generators, telephone network, roads, bridges, trains, national airline (our old QANTAS), banks our old Commonwealth Bank) our airports, Commonwealth Serum Laboratories (CSL) , etc etc, all in the national interest, no we cannot do it, we need to hand them over to a few to control them and pay them enormous amounts of money to do what we have been doing for generations, Sorry Australians, you have not got what it takes anymore, hand over your family jewels and go away quietly and let the chosen few take control. off you go....

Thanks Tim. The thing with shopping mall consumer culture is that it's trans-national. If I slip down to the local hyper-mall I could just as easily be in Vancouver or Los Angeles as in Canberra. And why would it be any different? Business is increasingly multi-national. Starbucks in every city etc. The media reflects this and reinforces a feedback loop that progressively divorces people from the social and ecological environments that they live in. Internationalists of 'left' and 'right' persuasion either see this as no cause for alarm, or even as a positive thing. But is it? The environmental effects of not "thinking ourselves into the landscape" are patently obvious. On environmental grounds alone, we should encourage people to build appropriate houses and commercial structures, plant native gardens and make appropriate use of native species for agriculture and as companion animals. But instead, we see broadacre developments of faux-Tuscan style houses with no eaves, black tiled roofs and gargantuan air conditioning systems. No space for clotheslines, but electric tumble driers in every dwelling. This in parts of Australia where 40 degree + days are a regular occurence through summer! Planning laws do nothing to limit the madness, even though there are some great examples around of buildings designed to work with the environment to provide superior accommodation, with a much reduced footprint. Anyone can own a cat or dog - despite the obvious effect that feral cats and dogs have on native species - but you risk prosecution if you feed the blue tongue lizard that lives under your stairs. Agriculture is still often carried out in ways that just don't suit the climate, soils and landscape in Australia. At the risk of repetition, I'd urge Australian readers to have a look at Michael Archer and Bob Beale's 'Going Native' for a more thorough examination of these issues. So some aspects of Australian culture are - or should be - shaped by our environment. But others are shaped by social factors and these are sometimes harder to quantify. Australians share a language and other ways of life that largely reflect a historically European heritage. English is the official language. Christianity is nominally the predominant form of religion. Our legal structures are descended from English systems. But over time, we've evolved some cultural elements that are uniquely Australian. Not British-Australian, not anything-Australian - just Australian. Examples include a culture of mateship and association with the 'underdog' that derives from the conditions prevalent in the convict period (see, for instance, Russel Ward's The Australian Legend). A fondness for sport and other outdoors activity reflects a climate conducive to these things; we've even derived a unique form of football (AFL). There have been some excellent films made that utilise the unique light and landscapes here. I could go on for ever, but.. The thing with all of these cultural aspects is that none of them are in any way exclusive to one racial group or another. They are - in fact - inclusive rather than divisive in nature. So in a country as diverse as Australia, these things should surely be encouraged. A single, modern national culture will go some way to building true harmony. Encouraging people to cling to the cultures of their homelands, while at the same time preaching tolerance at them, will not. Australian culture's squeezed between the Californiculture of TV on one hand and the tribalism of official multicultural policies on the other. We should be building a modern Australian culture that's unique, inclusive and environmentally appropriate. The foundations are there. To do so in a comprehensive way would involve all levels of Government and include the broadest scope of activity. Assimilation to such a culture would be something that all Australians could work on together, over time. It's as different from the 'Fit In or F*** Off' model as multiculturalism, and infinitely better than either. Or at least I think so.. :) Cheers .
Tony Boys's picture

Mike, You said, "If the economy does not grow, then interest on debts incurred to finance this growth cannot be repaid." So then is it not the interest that we have to forgive and forego and not the debts? In a steady state economy, people can lend each other money and expect to get it back, but there will be no interest. I'm not an expert. If I'm wrong, please show me why.

Subject was: Lip service - JS

Before you go thinking this is a major step, the environment commission is not city council and these statements are not binding policy and do not represent any real commitment on the part of anyone with real power. What's more, there is no mention of contraception or fertility rates making this basically a statement in the interests of real estate speculators who want to limit the housing supply so that prices will explode with population. This is not an effort to actually reduce population in a way that would reduce housing demand and prices but merely a way to make Bloomington more elite.

Limiting housing units does nothing to limit population or help the environment. It only causes homelessness.

Once again Dave shocks me with another of his typically astute comments. I don't believe anyone has discussed assimilation in these terms before. Certainly not in Canada. It has always been framed in terms of "these people should learn to speak OUR language and learn OUR customs". I think Dave is saying that it is WE who should learn the "language" of the environment where we actually live rather than the environment our grandparents emigrated from. The New Canadians from Asia and southern Europe who live in urban colonies in the five major Canadian cities are not really connected to the land to which they emigrated to. But the native born white yahoos who wreck the landscape with ATVs and snowmobiles and work it as industrial loggers have no spiritual affinity to it either. And most aboriginals, according to my observation, have been corrupted by this crass culture. So the question, Dave, then, is, assimilation, by all means. But assimilation into what? Assimilation into mindless shopping mall consumerism? Assimilation into insensitivity toward the natural word by a rainbow coalition of Caucasian, Asian, African and Aboriginal spenders, recreationists and workers? All knit together by a common language and harmony and tolerance? If this is the case, I am for anarchy. Nihilism. Let it all fly apart. Let all hell break loose. Tim
mike's picture

Subject was: steady state economics - JS

This is good news. HOWEVER, I wonder if any of the authors of this statement remotely understand what enormous change this would entail. I have to say I had no understanding of it until recently myself, but to change from a growth economy to a steady state one means forgiving all debts, because a growth economy is a debt economy. If the economy does not grow, then interest on debts incurred to finance this growth cannot be repaid.

At this stage, one has two choices: bankrupt everyone (which is more or less what happened to most of the poor in the Great Depression), or forgive all the debts and start with a blank slate, my preferred option.

This last option is in any case the only possible outcome of the collapse of the financial sector which is currently unraveling. We can either do this in a civilised manner, OR do the usual, fight wars over all of the remaining scraps.

Time will tell which way we as a civilisation decide to go, but there is no doubt we all live in interesting times!

Take the crash course at www.chrismartenson.com while we're at it... better have a strong cuppa in your hands!

Mike.

A pessimist is a well informed optimist

Increasingly I get the feeling of being surrounded by cosmetically-enhanced consumers, all dancing to the new world order beat, and a smattering of misfits often diagnosed with newfangled psychiatric disorders. We've been conditioned to want more of everything, more consumer gadgets, more people, more politically correct rhetoric, more lip service to green issues. Sometimes less is better.

Hi Tim,

"But realize that [it] is not external forces that are making you run so quickly on a treadmill."

Wouldn't it be nice if..., but if whatever you're dreaming of, like taking a trip to Pluto, isn't a possibility, are you still going to get worked up over not having it? You can only really desire what is realistically within your grasp.

"There she stood in the doorway, I heard the mission bells,
I was thinking to myself, 'This could be heaven or this could be hell.'
Then she lit up a candle, and she showed me the way,
There were voices down the corridor, I thought I heard them say..."

I think people are led to consumerism and greediness. They have a choice, but only just about. Most people are not aware they have that choice.

Like Pahom in Tolstoy's story, most people want to live a little more comfortably, "conveniently" as we say in Japan, and so they work hard to improve their lives. Some people, unlike Pahom, unlike most people who live in the advanced industrial nations today, do know when they have enough - that just enough when life is fairly comfortable, and your possessions are not much of a burden on you.

But I think what we have today, and it is very clear in many young Japanese people, is a sheer, crass consumerism that blinds people to the realities of life and living. This, one can say, is the result of the energy revolution of the past 250 years or so. But did it really have to be like this?

How DID it get like this? Why do we have this culture of greed that validates addiction to all this stuff? Did it just happen because everyone is naturally greedy?

I don't think so.

"Just wait until the oil economy is done. You’re going to get a crash course in Amish living and I am going back to the future.. You’ll have lots of time to slow down then and get re-connected with the people around you."

That would be nice. I think a lot of people are hoping that this will be the end result of "Peak Oil". If it were true. Tim, please spare me about 20 minutes to read my G8 biofuelling biofeudalism, because I think it's much scarier than that. Enjoy a cup of (Japanese green) tea while you read it, if you like.

Dear Tim, Thanks so much for your comments. No need to feel guilty, though. Italian society is not united to combat its ills. Right and Left are tearing society apart. The criminals, of whatever origin or affiliation , profit from this state of affairs. There are voices, for example, that call for opening the gates even further, because it is our fault if the Africans (Indians, Rumanians, Romas, etcetera) are poor. Frankly, with this type of logic there will be no more space to accommodate the Third World, because of the immense guilt of the White Man. These people who recommend such open door policies don't explain why Zimbabwe, who used to be a rich country, is now one of the poorest in the world. Is this our fault too? And if I say that Mugabe is a monster, should I be accused of being a racist? Some friends of mine went to Canada for a vacation and didn't want to come back! ( do not fear, they are back) They felt in Paradise, They couldn't believe what they saw: inexplored wilderness, peace, beautiful unspoiled landscape, and kind and law-abiding people to go with it. How do you manage to preserve all this? Low population density? Intelligent governments? Cooperative people? Low immigration rates? Good luck Marisa

It's clear that assimilation is important from an environmental perspective. Agriculture in Australia has historically been about farming European species in European ways. Many farmers continue to do so, even though salinity problems, the impact on native species, loss of topsoil and water stress all indicate that such practices are far from sustainable. Aside from mainstream agriculture, previous generations have imported plant and animal species that reminded them of 'home'. Foxes and rabbits, introduced for sport, have had a huge impact on our native species as well as reducing agricultural productivity. Lantana now degrades over 4 million hectares of Australia's environment. Of course, all this is well known to most year 6 students, but what's less well considered is the role that assimilation - or the lack of it - played in making it all possible. Consider the early British colonists. Were they committed to Australia, our land, plants and animals? Did they feel any connection to Australia? Was it 'home' for them? Of course not. They were English (or Scottish or Irish or...) plain and simple. And to our eternal cost, succesive generations were actively encouraged to feel the same. Despite the good work of people like those in the Jindyworobak movement, many Australians still related to Menzies 'British-to-the-bootstraps' outlook as late as the 1950's. So the early colonists - and their heirs - proceded to replace all this weird native flora and fauna with more familiar species. Make it more like home. And their children and grandchildren, inheriting their farm, inherited their attitudes too. This was 'British-Australian' culture in action. Bugger the consequences. Had there been greater awareness of - and respect for - Australia's environment, the early colonists and their descendants might have found that native species provided answers to some of their problems. Bob Beale and Michael Archer have explored these themes in 'Going Native', a book I'd strongly recommend. Indeed, if the development of a modern Australian native culture had been more actively fostered in the past, many of the environmental problems of today could have been mitigated. Now, I think it's natural for immigrants to feel an attachment to their homelands. It's also right for Australians to take up ways of living that originated elsewhere, if those practices are environmentally and culturally appropriate. No one's too worried about being able to get a good gelatto. But over time, it's also natural for later generations to adapt to the cultural norms of their new homes. Having official policies that work against this trend is like Canute trying to hold back the tide. Pointless and - in the meantime - divisive and damaging. .

I received this e-mail on Friday 1 August. Hi James, This is a fantastic and informative warning for the premier. I hope he takes it to heart. Could you please let me know his response. Many thanks for all you are doing. Hans Brunner

Tax funded schools and childcare destroy the environment and raise rents and oil prices by exploiting the childless of all colors and classes, especially sports programs which also encourage bullies. Parents would stop moving in and polluting if we quit luring them here with public schools. Many local employers and landlords already do it secretly, but they need to openly discriminate against heterosexuals(1), which is still legal in North Carolina, because they use too much parental leave and childcare benefits. Footnotes 1. North Carolina (NC), in the South East of the United States, has not yet banned hiring discrimination on the basis of sexual preference. - JS.

Please also see the short article Biofuels threaten to turn Kenya's Tana Delta into ecological wasteland, which shows how the production of bioethanol can be an ecological danger even when not carried out on cropland. Bioethanol can, and I think will be, an important energy source in the future, but only if it is produced and used in a responsible way. Corporations will not do this. Small-scale producers might.

Hi d.j. hunt! I'm assuming you live in the Rockhampton/Yeppoon area. Is there much local support for a coal terminal at Port Clinton? Is local opposition strong enough for the Bligh government to abandon these ridiculous plans?

I attended this meeting and the organisers did a fantastic job. It was very fair and very balanced and I was able to find out facts I did not know. This proposal really scares me as I said on the night in relation to the threat to an endangered species, being the dugong, that live in this area. Everybody needs to let the govt. know the risk to these dugongs is not acceptable and support the Capricorn Conservation Council

Whilst the stupidity of the policies of the Brisbane City Council and the Queensland Government's policy of making us all dependent upon the private motor vehicle is all too obvious to deny, I don't agree with congestion tax as a solution. I consider it regressive and hurts the poor the hardest and I can't see how it is fundamentally different from road tolls.

In any case the voters of London have recently voted Ken Livingstone out in favor of the Conservative Party candidate Boris Johnson. At the time it was reported in the news principle reason for Boris Johnson's victory was the rejection by Londoners of the congestion tax.

So, Ken Livingstone's confidence that opposition to the congestion tax would diminish over time has been shown to have been misplaced.

I think we have to advocate polices which remove any need for a congestion tax. These would include, obviously more public transport, and greater decentralisation so that the need for regular travel into Brisbane's CBD would be removed. The most critical change of all, of course, would be to end the reckless encouragement of population growth by all three levels of Government in Brisbane. Whatever gains are to be made from such a regressive charge will only be negated as they surely would have been in London by population growth (see How mass migration has devastated the social fabric of Britain of 7 Jul 08).

Copyright notice: Reproduction of this material is encouraged as long as the source is acknowledged.

Thanks for this Tristan. Here's a post (comment 60 of 132 of 15 Jul 08) I made to the Courier Mail discussion you referred to:

As I wrote in an unpublished letter on 23 May:

"Could the Courier Mail's editorial writers please remind us why they supported these white elephants (the Hale Street Bridge, the NSBT, etc.) when every informed person was predicting that the cost of petroleum was going to go through the roof as it now has?"

If the Courier Mail had done the job it is supposed to do and subjected these stupid projects to normally acceptable standards journalistic scrutiny and had given the case against these projects the coverage they deserved, Brisbane would not be in the mess it is in today.

Copyright notice: Reproduction of this material is encouraged as long as the source is acknowledged.

On July 29th, 2008 Brigitte Charron wrote Kelvin Thomson MP Labor Shadow Minister for Environment and Heritage Matters 3 Munro Street, Coburg 3058 Sunday, 6 October 2002 Dear Mr Kelvin Thomson MP, I recently received your Electorate Report and I am pleased to know that you are campaigning to stop land clearing as part of your environmental portfolio. I want to congratulate you and let you know that you have my full support. I would like to bring to your attention an issue that concerns me greatly. As the Shadow Minister for Environment in the Labor Party, you may be aware that the kangaroo industry in Australia kills kangaroos at the rate of 6 million a year with the full approval of our Federal Department of Primary Industry. The kangaroo industry promotes the wholesale slaughter of kangaroos as a sustainable harvest¹. How can it be sustainable when the strong males are the first casualties of a commercial slaughter?. In a cynical kilo for dollars exercise which leaves many writhing in agony from misfired bullet wounds, the alpha males offer the best yield to the shooters. Killing the biggest and best out of a mob is a threat to the future survival of the species because even though there is an increase in populations, the animals are not healthy, not fit, and the populations are unsustainable. The kangaroo and the Federal Government have not taken into consideration the depletion of the gene pool. The kangaroo has become a resource after decades of ignorant perception as pests. Proper public education has not been undertaken; Australians should have been deprogrammed from that sorry state of thinking Most Australians think that kangaroo numbers are far higher than they actually are and it is in the interest of Governments and the kangaroo industry to uphold this myth. Australia has approximately 230 million sheep and 37 million cattle, which is the plague? What animals cause the most destruction? Another disturbing fact to consider is the cruelty inflicted on kangaroos by the kangaroo industry. The cruelty comes in two forms. Shooting is not an exact science because of the many variables and the result does cause horrific non-fatal injuries. To quantify the wounding rate is near impossible. It is not acceptable to a civilisation like Australia, who prides itself on how it regards other creatures and which goes so far as to give a mandate to the Royal Society for the Protection of Animals to stop such excesses. Apart from the wounding rate, the other form of cruelty is so extreme that the publication, The Commercial Harvest of Kangaroos in Australia, steers well away from anything but mere mention. Females of breeding age killed usually have a joey at foot and a joey in the pouch. When the mother is killed, this joey at foot is left to fend for itself. Panic, fear, starvation or being preyed upon by the hundreds of foxes that keep tabs on kangaroo shooting will end its life in a state of terror. Also, too small to be lucrative, more than a million joeys are removed from their mother¹s pouch and tossed aside to die from predation or beaten to death by the shooters. This is not acceptable to reasonable thinking people The fate of the joeys is the cruelest of all. The commercial exploitation of any wildlife leads inevitably to their near extinction. The kangaroo is no exception. The kangaroo industry is responsible for the worst massacre of wild animals in history. We have already lost six kangaroo and wallaby species from the genetic pool and there a re a number of other species on the endangered list and nearing extinction. If we do not stop the exploitation of kangaroos, our national icon will be no more than a museum exhibits for future generations. We are harvesting our future. We are doing it with such momentum and conviction that we have swept aside the knowledge and wisdom that exists to show us how it might be done, for us all. For the animals. For the plants. For ourselves to find the harmony in an all-sustaining planet. The commercial harvesting of kangaroos must stop, with non-comsumptive use of wildlife for tourism introduced. I thank you for taking the time to read my letter and look forward to hearing from you in regards to your opinion on this matter. I hope you will support the protection of our wildlife, not its exploitation. Sincerely Brigitte Charron

I wouldn't call it a fantasy. Remember Telstra. They chipped away over successive governments and eventually got their evil undemocrtic way. Don't let up for a minute on Iemma; he is bad news. He is a dinosaur capitalist.

"I was flabberghasted to read Kelvin Thompson statement that he cares about nature. Pat O'Brien and I met with his advisor and we tried for months to get an appointment to see him about kangaroos and he did not give us the time of day and failed to answer any correspondencce about the plight of kangaroos." Maryland Wilson (Maryland Wilson is the President of the Australian Wildlife Protection Council (AWPC). Pat O'Brien, is the President of Wildlife Protection Association of Australia and Co-ordinator of the National Kangaroo Protection Coalition)

Uh-oh. I did wonder about publishing Kelvin Thomson's speech. It did seem too good to be true. I immediately received two comments about how the Minister has seemingly failed to live up to his words here, which you may read below. I would like to hear from anyone who is able to show that Mr Thomson actually puts his money where his mouth is with regard to standing up for Australian species.

(This post is also a response to Passy's posts on an Online Opinion discussion forum in response to the article 'Populate or perish'? of 24 Jul 08.) In the very broadest sense, Passy may be correct, when he wrote:
Is there any evidence we have passed our so called optimal population level? Just because it is blindingly obvious to you doesn't make it so, or correct.
No-one can definitively prove, that is, until it is too late, that the planet is over-populated to the point, where some theoretically better society than the one we have now, cannot rise to overcome all the problems that now seem intractable - exhaustion of fossil fuel reserves, exhaustion of stocks of rare metals, global warming, destruction of rainforests, extinction of other species, destruction of agricultural land, destruction of river systems, the lowering of underground water tables upon which much of the world's agriculture depends, the destruction of fish stocks, etc, etc. However, on the basis of overwhelming data, it seems to me intuitively unlikely that even the most perfect, equitable and democratic possible form of social organisation would be sufficiently superior to capitalism as to enable to easily solution all of these problems, particularly if they were to be compounded by the addition of over two billion more to the global human population. As I pointed out earlier, all the advances in human productivity in recent centuries have correlated very closely to our unsustainable and accelerated rate of consumption of finite non-renewable natural resources, particularly fossil fuel energy, so it seems far more likely that that, rather than advances in human knowledge, is the major driver of seemingly improved human productivity. So, as Divergence, Ludwig, ozideas and others have suggested, it would be extremely reckless not to assume that humanity's numbers have overshot the carrying capacity of our biosphere, regardless of what form of social system we eventually adopt and and it would be extremely reckless not to begin, as a matter of utmost urgency, to stabilise human numbers without any further delay. As I have made clear elsewhere, I agree with Passy think we can do a lot better than we are we are with the rapacious, inefficient and grotesquely iniquitous globalised system of capitalism that we now live under, but unlike Passy, I won't be placing my faith in claims of the virtually unlimited capacity of human intelligence made by most socialists as well as by neo-liberal apologists for our current economic system.

Bizarrely sexist comment by the truckie husband. Makes his wife sound like a cross between a productive breeding animal and a sex-toy. And might just as well be, by being so out of touch with the world around as it is impacted by population growth and the industrial expansion which serves it. Then again, the mainstream press has this way of seeking out the yuk factor in the daily affairs of people who just do what they think is okay; this family is obviously responding to religious and economic propaganda. The news reports are glorifying this for some purpose of their own - to sell papers and to sell population growth, which will enhance their many corporate capital investments by increasing inflation. Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page Copyright to the author. Please contact sheila [AT] candobetter org or the editor if you wish to make substantial reproduction or republish.

Thanks, 'duped'.

Even though many of us rightly feel badly let down in many regards by the Rudd Government, I still think it would be wrong to draw the conclusion that we should not have chosen them over the Liberal Government last year. If nothing else, at least those who want something better than the astonishingly abysmal Government of John Howard can claim a lot more legitimacy than would otherwise be the case. Furthermore, if Howard had won, the process of disillusionment that we are now going through would have only been put back yet another three years, after which Labor could well have been even more right-wing than it now is.

If Labor does not prove equal to the task before it, then we need to find better alternatives and not merely allow the pendulum to swing back, once again, to the Liberal Party. If we allow that to happen, then we will only back to where we are now in 10 or 15 years time, if we are lucky.

Copyright notice: Reproduction of this material is encouraged as long as the source is acknowledged.

Quite right Stoptac. I was one of those influenced by Kerry O'Brien's pre-election assurances that the Labor Party would not tolerate animal cruelty. To add insult to injury, I received a letter from Mr Rudd's office post election offering the same assurances. These assurances were given after he'd approved the resumption of live trade to Egypt. Anyone who has the slightest regard for animals would be aware of the heinous barbarity perpetrated by the Egyptians on Australia's hapless, export animals. Rudd is a hypocrite - a callous leader and Australia's reputation, as a "civilised" nation, has indeed been tarnished.

Forgot to add that Paul Sheehan is the author of 'Among the Barbarians', which contains one particularly inspiring chapter entitled Green Thunder. Strongly recommended.

It would be easier to justify the argument that Spain is part of Africa. Spain is 13 km from the African mainland (Morocco). Darwin is some 700km from Timor Leste. Spain has been culturally and architectually influenced by Moorish habitation and Morocco has been invaded by Spain (1859-1860). Australian culture has had little impact in Asia. Aside from some culinary influence, Asian cultures have had little impact in Australia. But Spain is not part of Africa and you'd be considered crazy for suggesting that it is. Australia IS a continent in its own right and a nation with a people, landscape, culture and environment unlike that of any Asian nation. Attempts to place Australia in Asia can often be traced back to business interests with an eye on the spectacular growth of China, or leftists confusing a move towards Asia with 'independence'. The irony, of course, is that 'our Asian destiny' is just the lastest in a series of dependencies that started with Mother England and then went all the way with LBJ. Strange how often business interests and the mainstream left in Australia agree, isn't it? .

Marisa, This is about the most brilliant analysis of a complex subject that I have ever read. I think that it would be poetic justice that Canada offer some compensation to Italy for bearing the brunt of so much illegal immigration. You rightly point out that the impetus for this mass migration is overpopulation for want of birth control programs. Canada, as our Senate report of 2007 concluded, has been criminally responsible for participating in the wasting of more than a half a trillion dollars in African development aid in the last 40 years not made conditional on family planning. We have fueled population booms that have left people more miserable than they were before aid was dispensed, and living in countries whose environments have been left utterly destitute by the increased human numbers. What is the result? Africa is poorer. Canada's working class is poorer because their tax dollars paid for the aid. And Italy's social safety net, its health budget, criminal justice system and educational system is breaking under the strain of an illegal African wave. And then you have the Romas. That we can help you with. Our official state ideology is Multiculturalism and we are always seeking ways to make ourselves more culturally diverse. Could we import 50,000 Gypsy pickpockets to make up for some migratory pressure that our unconditional foreign aid in Sub-Saharan Africa placed upon Italy? Ottawa's Department of Foreign Affairs and Citizenship can set up tables at the train stations in Naples, Milan and Rome to recruit the most promising Roma children. The thieves with the fastest hands, who can also dance and sing at the festival on Canada Day will be waved to the head of the queue and given instant citizenship. Our favourite criminals though, are still the billionaires from Hong Kong and elsewhere. We love developers best because they bribe and lobby politicians and newspapers to open the floodgates in the first place. It's a circle game isn't it?

Submitted to the Hobart Mercury, the Examiner (Launceston) and the Advocate (NW Tasmania) Dear Editor The last direct shipment of Tasmanian sheep left Devonport in February 2006, amid a storm of angry protest. 71,309 sheep, many ill and injured, were loaded onto the aging "Al Messilah", a former car transporter, and 1,632 died on the ship during the marathon 27 day journey. A report by the Australian Quarantine Inspection Service (AQIS) identified that a major cause of the mortalities was the fact that Tasmanian sheep are particularly poorly adapted to the heat exhaustion they suffer on lengthy, cross-equatorial journeys, along with disease, other trauma and starvation. This was not, however, the end of the live export trade in Tasmanian sheep (or cattle). They are now shipped and trucked to Portland in Victoria, and exported from there, although this does not appear on LiveCorp's "State of Origin" statistics. Enquiries to the Minister for Primary Industries, David Llewellyn, have elicted the extraordinary response that the Department doesn't actually know how many animals are involved, but he thinks it may be "possibly 15,000 to 20,000 in 2007 - 2008". Why does his Department not know, for Heavens sake? We have pointed out that if Tasmanian sheep cannot cope with a direct journey from Devonport, they arguably suffer far, far more with added journey from farm in Tasmania all the way to Portland, and all before being loaded on to live export ships. Mr Llewellyn is "awaiting advice" on this. So are we. STOP TASMANIAN ANIMAL CRUELTY PO Box 252 BRIDGEWATER TAS 7030

Many Australian animal advocates would have supported Rudd's election based on his statement "I cannot abide cruelty" (referring to the live export trade), and (then) Agriculture spokesman Kerry O'Brien's statements about it on Landline. O'Brien got the sentiments of the Australian community right, and Rudd and Burke have got it so wrong. As public awareness grows about the appalling cruelty involving intensively farmed animals, Rudd and Burke will come under increasing fire for their hypocrisy - and that's as it should be. Conditions under which battery hens, meat chickens, pigs, and cattle in feedlots, along with the live export trade, bring Australia into disrepute worldwide, and are to be deplored. If you have ever had hens whose former wretched existence was a space smaller than a A4 sheet of paper, who have never been able to stretch their wings or known sunshine and fresh air, you will understand. Australians should be demanding "truth in labelling" about how their chicken, eggs, beef and pork have been "produced". and nothing less. If this cruelty were to be carried out upon "companion animals" the perpetrators would be prosecuted. All animals have, as an absolute minimum, the right to the Five Freedoms, identified by the UK Farm Animal Welfare Committee decades ago:- 1. Freedom from Hunger and Thirst - by ready access to fresh water and a diet to maintain full health and vigour. 2. Freedom from Discomfort - by providing an appropriate environment including shelter and a comfortable resting area. 3. Freedom from Pain, Injury or Disease - by prevention or rapid diagnosis and treatment. 4. Freedom to Express Normal Behaviour - by providing sufficient space, proper facilities and company of the animal's own kind. 5. Freedom from Fear and Distress - by ensuring conditions and treatment which avoid mental suffering”. Australia is not doing very well at all, is it?

Original subject heading was "Australia's place in the world" - JS

Australia’s population is rising at 1.6% a year, faster than Indonesia next door, and one of the fastest rates in Asia.

Australia is not actually "in Asia"; it's a separate continent in its own right. To assert that Australia is a part of Asia is to not only make a geographically false statement, it is to parrot one of the favourite arguments used by immigration enthusiasts. The open borders crowd like to claim that since Australia is a "part of Asia", it has an obligation to transform itself into Lebensraum for the populations to our north (Phil Ruthven, a notorious immigration fanatic, used this exact argument during a debate about population on ABC's Difference of Opinion [Read transcript]). By redefining Australia as a mere extension of Asia, it becomes impossible to defend our uniqueness as a continent-nation and, therefore, much harder to justify one's opposition to mass immigration.

"We are a very culturally diverse community, which is another reason why people are moving to the state." What Ms. Green should have said: "We are giving the populations of other countries the green light to colonise Victoria, which is another reason why people are moving to the state." The fact that immigrants are only moving to Victoria to join their co-ethnics should be ringing alarm bells. It shows that they have little interest in embracing mainstream Australian society and culture. Put bluntly, Ms. Green's idea of "cultural diversity" sounds more like cultural colonisation to me.

James I think capitalism is both a system of scarcity and of over-production within the paramaters of its created scarcity. This is because its driving force is production for profit. So the development of commodities occurs not to satisfy human need but to make a profit. The two are often not contiguous. Food is on example. Enough food is produced to feed everyone adequately on the planet, now and I believe into the future. (Malthus was wrong then and he is wrong now, for the same reaons. Indeed his arguments were based on an extremely reactionary view of the world which saw the elite as the real humans and the hoi polloi as garbage.) What stands in the way of feeding everyone now? It is not profitable to do so. Remove the profit motive and the overproduction of food (ie 3 bn people do not have enough money to buy enough food to avoid malnourishment or starvation) is removed and those in hunger can be fed. To argue that there are immutable laws that mean we have reached our limits now is to agree with what Malthus argued. Yet the history of humanity shows in fact that food production has increased at a rate greater than population growth. To argue that we need to "think shrink" is to accept the capitalist ideas of scarcity and overproduction. It is perhaps to advocate a return to feudalism. It brings to mind Rosa Luxemburg's prophetic words that the choice for humanity is socialism or barbarism. Removing the profit motive, with workers creating a society in which production is determined democratically to satisfy human need, means the current capitalist fetters on satisfying human need can be lifted and essential human needs like food, housing, clothing, education and medical care can be addressed for all of humanity, not just those with the money to afford it.

This comment comes from a press release dated Tuesday 15 July, "Where's the probity? Why can they get away with it?" by MP Sharman Stone, at http://www.sharmanstone.com/Pages/article.aspx?ID=678 Victorian Liberal MP for Murray, Sharman Stone writes: "The Victorian Labor Government has contracted out key evaluations for the business case for upgrading the Goulburn-Murray Irrigation System, leaving construction firms who are expected to vie for future the project work, to determine whether it’s worth doing the work or not. The federal funding of the so-called Stage Two of the Foodbowl Modernisation was contingent on a ‘due diligence’ study, which you would normally expect to be carried out by an independent government department, according to Dr Sharman Stone, Shadow Minister for Environment, Heritage, the Arts and Indigenous Affairs and Federal Member for Murray. “When the Brumby Labor Government finally signed on to the Murray Darling Basin National Water Security Plan, they were allocated $1 billion for Stage Two of the Foodbowl Modernisation Scheme, contingent on a due diligence study. “In an extraordinary move, the Victorian Government has asked the potential contractors to prepare the project evaluation. Some of these contractors are already working on Stage One of the project, which includes the construction of the controversial North South Pipeline. “This study into Stage Two needs to determine the water savings for the project, which works will be carried out and whether or not the project represents best value for money for the taxpayer. The potential project contractors should not be allowed anywhere near the preparation of the case arguing for best value. Dr Stone said the Victorian Government’s decision to allow the big engineering companies to basically design their own future project was made behind closed doors. Such a move must call the independence of the report into question. “Taxpayers need to know the Victorian Government now has quite a history of compromising proper process in relation to water planning in the state. The North South Pipeline, for example, has been set in motion by the Brumby Government without social, economic or comprehensive environmental evaluation. No due diligence was undertaken at all. The recent Auditor General’s report into the state’s water plan slammed this poor practice. “Already, millions of dollars worth of pipes have been purchased without tender and lie waiting for connection before the Federal Government’s EPBC Act scrutiny has been completed. Landowners along the pipeline route are being pressured to open their properties to pre-construction activity. “Taxpayers must be concerned that these projects are not being subjected to proper scrutiny, transparency and evaluation. The Foodbowl Modernisation Stage Two project is critical for the future viability of northern Victoria’s food production and the sustainability of the Murray Darling Basin. Already there are concerns that Stage One is being rushed with shody work and lack of proper planning. “A proper due diligence study must consider all aspects of the Foodbowl Modernisation plan including the diversion of water via a pipeline out of the Murray Darling Basin. Best value for money considerations must include an evaluation of the alternatives for drought proofing Melbourne and Geelong. These quite clearly include recycling and stormwater harvesting. “Mr Brumby seems hell-bent on pressing ahead without the usual safeguards. It is therefore incumbent upon Federal Water Minister Penny Wong to step in and insist on best practice." [Sharman Stone is the Federal Member for Murray and Federal Shadow Minister for the Environment. Dr Stone has been Federal Member for Murray since being elected in 1996, was Minister for Workforce Participation from January 2006 to November 2007, under the Howard Government. She is an anthropologist and sociologist. Her first ministerial appointment was as Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister for the Environment and Heritage from 1998 to 2004.] Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page Copyright to the author. Please contact sheila [AT] candobetter org or the editor if you wish to make substantial reproduction or republish.

Recently I received a response from a Victorian politician to a submission I made about a new code for pregnant sows. My submission had asked for more humane conditions. The politician replied in a manner which I found myself unable to answer. His reply was that he would vote for more humane conditions, but that he thought few other politicians were going to. He stressed that he wasn't going to vote for less cruel conditions on the grounds that pigs had rights; he was going to vote for them because, since, in his view, we are a wealthy society, we can afford to be kinder to domestic animals and that it would be the decent thing to do. He then added that pigs were not very nice animals and often ate their young. I was aghast and confused. On the one hand, for me, the idea that other creatures have no rights, is pitiful and illogical. It is clear, however, that more and more people share this mean belief. They are mis-educated in this way by commercial and religious forces which have something to gain by inculcating ignorance and a tolerance for cruelty. On the other hand, this was the only politician I heard from who, in the belief (shared my most politicians) that the country was doing well, was prepared to give something back to those creatures who live and die without choice and only for our benefit. This politician's response was therefore more worthy than his colleagues'. However, the question of pigs eating their young was the worst part of the politician's answer. Why? Because it was so unbearably callous and unthinking. Do wild pigs eat their young? They are not known for this. So, how come domestic pigs are known for this? Well, consider the picture that accompanies Vivienne's article. If you were raised from childhood in suffering by people who despised you so much that they kept you in darkness, fed you shit, gave you no room, kept you filthy, never spoke kindly to you, treated you roughly and then marched you off to slaughter so that they could eat you, would you want your child to live? Either you would be so filled with learned self-loathing that you would destroy your child out of loathing, or you might, if some part of your spirit survived, destroy your child out of love. We don't give pigs any choice at all. Nor do we give the 'consumers' any choice, when we have governments which will, with a stroke of a pen, condemn to endless torment generations of animals, simply to save a few cents and win some votes. I guess you could expect the same kind of person who believes that industrial man is some kind of progressive evolution to also not question the received 'wisdom' that pigs are not very nice animals because they eat their young. I am afraid that the way we act in Australia towards other creatures means that we are not very nice animals ourselves. Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page Copyright to the author. Please contact sheila [AT] candobetter org or the editor if you wish to make substantial reproduction or republish.

In Australia, hundreds of thousands of "farmed" animals live short lives of abject, wretched suffering and misery. Pigs are known to have the intelligence of a three year old child, and to be more intelligent than dogs, yet up to 380,000 of these sensitive creatures are forced to live most of their lives and steel and metal crates barely larger than their bodies. They cannot turn around, and the "lucky" ones may be able to take one step back or forward. Their only experience of fresh air and sunshine will be when they are loaded on to trucks, bodies worn out, for slaughter. In their few short years, they have been impregnated until their bodies can take no more, they will have developed sores and ulcers, and painful muscle and bone deformities through their intensive confinement. They will have been forced-fed antibiotics just so that they can survive in the filthy environments in which they are forced to live. Decades ago, the Brambell Committee of the UK Farm Animal Welfare Council identified the "Five Freedoms" - the absolute minimum rights that all animals should have:- 1. Freedom from Hunger and Thirst - by ready access to fresh water and a diet to maintain full health and vigour. 2 Freedom from Discomfort - by providing an appropriate environment including shelter and a comfortable resting area. 3 Freedom from Pain, Injury or Disease - by prevention or rapid diagnosis and treatment. 4 Freedom to Express Normal Behaviour - by providing sufficient space, proper facilities and company of the animal's own kind. 5 Freedom from Fear and Distress - by ensuring conditions and treatment which avoid mental suffering”. And Australia has the highest standards of animal welfare in the world? Think intensive pig farming, meat chickens and battery hens, and think again. It is YOUR consumer dollar that will make a difference to the appalling lives (and deaths) of these wretched animals.

Thank you so much for writing this Vivienne. This is so much a consequence of industrialisation, big populations and being distanced from farming and other means of getting food. Humans need to try to make our social systems more localised so that we can have more power over the way that food is produced or produce our own, and so that we can choose whether to avoid these intolerable cruelties. Government standards at the moment are no standards at all. They are absence of standards and presence of unspeakable cruelty. Cruelty has been industrialised and our societies are depraved by it. Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page Copyright to the author. Please contact sheila [AT] candobetter org or the editor if you wish to make substantial reproduction or republish.

Briefly for now: As one who disputes that the former USSR and China were true socialist nations, I argue that it has neither been proven nor disproven that socialism can make possible the more efficient use of resources than the abysmally inefficient and iniquitous capitalist system. Nevertheless, if we assume that socialism can offer at least significant efficiencies over capitalism as I argue, we still should still accept that there are limitations to what the increases in efficiencies are possibilities are possible. Throughout most of the 20th and 21st centuries, most socialists have altogether denied that there are limits or have been vague and obfuscatory about what those limits are. They would have had us believe that everything, including overpopulation and rampant environmental destruction could be fixed once the attainment of socialism unleashed the claimed almost limitless creativity of humankind. What they have failed to acknowledge is that most of the apparent increase in human creativity of human history in recent centuries has directly correlated with the exploitation of non-renewable finite natural resources, particularly fossil fuels. When they are exhausted, even under a socialist system, we will, at best be struggling very hard to attain the productivity of even this capitalist society. Copyright notice: Reproduction of this material is encouraged as long as the source is acknowledged.

More on the effect of immigration on Australia's current account deficit: According to the Former Minister for Finance, Senator Peter Walsh, Australia's immigration program during the late 1980s was dramatically expanded - primarily because of pressure on the Federal Government by ethnic leaders. By the late 1980s, immigration had imposed massive economic costs on Australia. High levels of immigration increased annual population growth to over 1.5 per cent, the highest in the developed world. According to Mr. Stephen Joske, an economist with the Australian Parliamentary Library, immigration increased demand for basic infrastructure - such as housing, hospitals, roads, and schooling. Because of Australia's low levels of domestic savings, investment capital for such infrastructure had to be imported from overseas, adding up to A$8.0 billion each year to Australia's current account deficit. By the early 1990s, Australia - with a population of only 17 million - had accumulated a foreign debt of over A$140 billion, equal to 40 percent of GDP and exceeding other major 'debtor' countries such as the former Soviet Union. A key cause of this debt 'blowout' was the high and unsustainable levels of immigration during the late 1980s. Stephen Rimmer, The Cost of Multiculturalism, The Social Contract, Volume 3, Number 1 (Fall 1992). Australia's foreign debt has ballooned since the 1980s, topping more than A$600 billion. Our current account deficit continues to exceed the "Banana Republic" levels experienced during the Hawke-Keating era. Yet, even in the face of this impending Argentina-like disaster, immigration is being ramped up to record high levels.

Certainly the 'boys' network kicks in strongly with the Labor Party. They forget they are elected to represent people in the electorate, not further party goals.

However, privatisation of the energy sector and introduction of smart metering is all part of a global energy market where the really big players move to monopolise the sector and fix the price. Better option is to enable all households and business to have a high level of energy self sufficiency including energy efficiency where major power generators are back up and not main options.

The 'market' paradigm delivers for wholesale purchasers of energy and usually households will pay the highest costs again, small players supporting the big players.

I think the focus is wrong. We need to work towards reducing energy consumption and increasing efficiencies and enabling micro or local solutions.

Chris Peters might be happier himself, relocating to a third world country with a very high ratio of young to old. Perhaps the ACT Branch of Sustainable Population Australia could start a fund to pay for his passage to Africa or the Middle East or South America. Chris Peters is no spring chicken himself and his departure would therefore decrease the risk of the scenario he fears will befall Canberra. Sheila Newman, population sociologist home page Copyright to the author. Please contact sheila [AT] candobetter org or the editor if you wish to make substantial reproduction or republish.

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